There’s a little bit of drama going around regarding the Holy Father  referring to a protestant, Tony Palmer, as “My brother bishop” in a video greeting addressing the Kenneth Copeland Ministries Conference recently.   But when we dig into the facts we see the comment—and the video in which it was spoken—in a greater, and more accurate context.  Was the pope  implying that there’s parity between the Catholic Church and Protestants, or is this just another case of “Gotacha!” that we’ve seen played against Pope Francis…by secularists and Catholics?  Comment below!  Get the Video and After-Show on this page by becoming a Gold Member for just $5/month; sign-up here!

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  • Nickdrakefan Jeanne M

    From all I have read about Islam, Allah is a moon god. Who in the bible are the people in the bible is there supposed to enmity between you know serpent biting heels and woman crushing the head. Why on my statue of Mary Is she standing on a serpent and a crescent moon. Im the bible their were splits and deceptions , From abrham, From Hagar, her son amd the 2 sons who deceived the father With the fake hairy arm. I don”t know a lot, but I do mot get The same God. and I have tried
    Thwy are the exact opposit of us. To th the wnds justifies the means, thwy can lie they can kill, and they are honerwd when thwy do. It seems to be sich a culture of death
    I DO not knpw. but They dp love tp Kill christians
    And Catholics are their worst enemy
    They scaree more tham anyone
    And I dp mpt to feel like that.
    There was an article on prophecy update, that prettyuch said the pops was heading the One world relogionpvent
    So I watched the video. I did not get that frpm it
    Kenneth Copelanss wife noq wants to to(return to her catholic roots, and a lot of people at that assembly , were crying and said Luther won
    So If they come back tp the church, It seems toe it will be trouble. Catholics cannot give up 1 thing. and everyone gets the opinion The pope Is goolng to change Everything to suit everyone. . I just do not know. I listen and kust comeaway wondering. . I want a good and Holy pope, I do not thinl all is well at the vatican, and the war between good and evil rages there. I will just watch, Too much argueing going on. and divisions. This video sounded no different than how I believe. . AS long as no dictrinal changes appear, and the fight between the sects of Catholics Ia just a headache. I thinl we are living in the last times, so anything can happen. But thats me.

  • cheeriosinmypocket

    Excellent aftershow Tim & Wilson! I came in at least an hour late to the regular show, it took me a very long time to figure out what the show was about, I made a comment that I was admonished for without hearing why as yet (but we are all busy), which I stand by…but first, I do want to thank you both for the aftershow for in that 15 minutes I gained an excellent perspective on a couple of things…
    - Pope addressing a Protestant as a Brother Bishop…Wilson states, his respect toward a Protestant Minister when addressing him saying, “Minister ?Lawrence?” to grab a name. Perfect! I would do the same…Pastor so-and-so. Great point!
    - Wilson’s confession was another excellent example…for the time may come where we will be thankful for brothers and sisters of faith in Christ…excellent food for thought, Brother.
    - Tim’s idea about Louis’ possible motive? Perhaps. I don’t know. Even though I’ve agreed with some things I’ve listened to him speak of, that doesn’t mean everything he says or does should be regarded as truth.
    - Finally, I risk missing more of your current show, but I still stand by my not having ever been certain as to Pope Francis’ “words” on anything for every time I hear of something he said, he wrote, he doodled, someone changes it, and sometimes they even change it again! He, our Pope, has my prayers. But until I learn Latin and read his encyclicals or he learns to speak English, I cannot trust what I hear nor what I read.

  • Guest

    Personally, I find it problematic that Francis calls the heretical “bishop” Palmer his “Brother Bishop” yest he wont even speak to SSPX and chides other Tradition Minded Catholics (yes, they actually are Catholic, unlike Protestant heretical Palmer “Anglican”).

    Too many Neo-Catholics believe the holy spit is always at work at hje election of every pontiff. This is not always the case. We have had many anti-Popes in the Church’s history. Time will only tell if Francis turns out to be the disaster his is seeming to be…

    • Salvelinus

      This is true – There have been anti-popes, but I dont think Vericast are contorting themselves to the “Neo-Catholic” label that I would give, say Catholic Answers Live. They are just embarrassing over there…. Something in the San Diego water system I think….

      Lets just chill, and give this pope some time. He is from South America and a Jesuit (although not a Fr. John Hardin Jesuit)… I love Harvesting the Fruit myself, but those types of blogs can be quite dangerous for many in that they can easily “jump ship” to the “soft sede” or full sedevacantist realm. This is Protestant, and our Lord doesnt want this – And I hope you dont want this.

    • tjhaines

      He wasn’t calling him a bishop he was just recognizing his title….not his office. I don’t understand why people aren’t seeing this for what it is. Seriously, have we become THAT drama-driven????? Are we SO BENT on criticism that something this insignificant becomes the topic of the month? We REALLY can’t apply reason here???. What the pope said was just buttering-up-nicey-talk, directed at people who are approaching the threshold of returning to the Church (even if they don’t know it). It’s not blind diplomacy.
      The Pope won’t speak to SSPX because they are not disposed to conversation, as they have exhibited time and again. Plus, he’s the pope. SSPX is a band of nobodies. Let them talk to a bishop or a cardinal, just as any other band of nobodies would be doing. For the record, I consider most of us a band of nobodies too, I don’t mean it in a purely negative way. You think too highly of SSPX. They’re a group of rebels. They are not the Sisters of Charity. At best, they’re a society of clergy and nothing more. They’re no more significant than the Friars of the Renewal, the Sisters of Life, or the Jesuits. So why should the pope go out of his way to grant them an audience? If there’s no need for one, then he shouldn’t. If there’s no purpose for one, then he shouldn’t. Nor should he meet with you or me if there’s no need or purpose. SSPX are not heroes, they are not champions…they are nobodies. Recognize them for what they are, not for how they think of themselves.
      Anti-Popes were effectively blank pontificates. The “anti-Popes” argument does not help your case, it actually hurts it. We’ve not had “many anti-Popes” we’ve had only a few. Keep in mind, largely the same men who elected Benedict XVI elected Francis.
      The Holy Spirit IS at work at every conclave. On rare occasion the wrong man seems to have been elected (anti-Popes) and the Holy Spirit put it right. So why are you worrying? The Holy Spirit doesn’t need your help, He needs your humility. Do what God put in front of you, not what he put in front of the Magisterium or what He Himself takes on through the Holy Spirit. Historically anti-popes did less to harm the Church than the proud

      • Vickie

        I have seen this thing with the SSPX crop up a couple of times. Asking why the Pope can be nice to Protestants but not to the SSPX.
        Tony Palmer went to the Pope in friendship. During that encounter he respectfully asked the Pope to send a greeting to a conference that he would be attending. Tony Palmer did not make any demands or dictate any terms. There was no agreement made for communion with the Protestants without resolving doctrinal differences or allowing that they did not have to acknowledge the authority of the Pope, a Council or the validity of our Mass. Nor did Tony Palmer or that conference criticize the Pope or the Magisterium. They enthusiastically received whatever the Pope was willing to give them and responded with joy, receptivity and respect.
        Excuse me if I am not seeing a similar attitude of humility from the SSPX and its supporters.

      • Salvelinus

        G

  • Salvelinus

    And by the Louie Verreccio knows his stuff – He has a whole program on Church Militant TV. It goes over the correct way to read the Vatican II council. It’s called “A Conversation With” – Check it out – It might be for paid members….

    Please explain “anti Vatican II”? Is that the Constitution on Religious Freedom and the Muslims or Gaudiam et spes?

    • tjhaines

      I think Verrecchio knows his stuff but also has an agenda that isn’t wholly honest or balanced. It comes out all over his work. From the clips and written quotes people send me, he SEEMS to be selective about what he discloses to the audience regarding the documents, and he slightly twists an interpretation here and there just far enough to make his case, even if the documents actually don’t support his application. If we call FOUL when modernists do that, we should call FOUL when any other Catholic does it. Now, when people send me typed quotes, I’m going by what they provide. Just because they put it in quotes doen’t mean it’s exactly what he has said. So I don’t put a whole lot of weight behind quotes and give him the benefit of the doubt by a pretty wide margin there. But I’m also going by what he himself has written, and the 1 or 2 clips I’ve seen.

      • Salvelinus

        Personally, I find Verrecchio’s website dangerous to my faith. I’ve actually had to wipe most blogs like Mundabor, Harvesting the Fruit, etc off of my browser because I’m just getting “out there” to the Right…. That is until I notice how much the Trads in the 3-piece Suits at the TLM I attend weekly actually annoy me to death!!

        I suppose I don’t belong anywhere – Either that or the man-made aspects of all of this is just stupid

  • David Manthei

    He didn’t call him “Brother Bishop”, he said “my bishop brother”. It’s a slight, but notable difference. As mentioned already, he wasn’t calling him a bishop in terms of any office, rather he was just recognizing his title in that faith tradition.

    • Salvelinus

      David. Did you also know that when Palmer expressed interest to converting to Catholicism, Francis told him not to?
      Did you also know that Francis insisted that “bishop Palmer” get a funeral mass, the kinds reserved only for Catholic bishops?

      This is all fact.
      I know that you want to defend the pope, and this is admirable, but come October I think you will be singing another tune.

      • http://daves-ahumbleservant.blogspot.com/ David Manthei

        I have not seen any credible source of information that suggests that Pope Francis discouraged conversion, nor that Palmer expressed interest. Palmer’s wife and children, however, were Catholic. Also, a Requiem Mass is not reserved for Bishops. It’s the funeral Mass of the Ancient Rite (a.k.a. Tridentine, a.k.a. Latin Mass). A Catholic Requiem Mass can be said for anyone, including non-Catholics with approval from the local Bishop. The article you provided says such permission was granted by the local Bishop. Where are you seeing that Palmer was buried “as a Bishop”? The article you provided hints that the Pope thought he should be, but provides no evidence either way and leaves the conclusion to speculation. Do you suppose it is wise to judge a person’s actions based on speculation?

        Why will I be singing a different tune in October? Is the office of the Papacy going to suddenly cease and the gates of hell prevail against the Church in October? I don’t think so.

        • tjhaines

          “Hints”, “Speculation”, and a host of other deceptive devices are precisely how radicals traditionalists build their illusions. Unfortunately, since they’re “Catholic-ish”, they sound credible and trustworthy, and so most people they sell their illusions to, having never felt the need to research the traditionalist’s claims, fall for their deceptions.

    • Salvelinus
  • http://daves-ahumbleservant.blogspot.com David Manthei

    I’m not aware of anything Pope Francis has said to chide Traditional-minded Catholics. I am actually a Traditional Catholic, and I have not felt chided by him in the least. Can you give a specific example, “Guest”, or are you just overgeneralizing and misrepresenting the Pope? And can you point out any refusal he has shown to communicate with SSPX. To my understanding, Benedict XVI reached out to SSPX and they snubbed him. Is there a reason that Francis should expect them to lend an ear to him this soon afterwards?

  • Daniel Rooke

    Just have to say YES YES YES. One of the main reasons for the awaking in the Faith was my submission to the Church. I was going to bad places but that trust brought me back and my Faith just keeps moving closer to Jesus. God Bless you guys, your very Good!

  • Salvelinus

    http://www.cfnews.org/page10/page97/tony_palmer_requiem_mass.html

    Is there really doubt anymore?
    The entire article is fully footnoted to dig into the actual facts of the questionable history of borgolio and Palmer.

    • tjhaines

      There is no doubt. You have an agenda. Your talking points are valueless, except for drama, and you need drama to fuel your anti-Church rhetoric because if you had to rely on substance you’d be left short. Naughty little Catholics like you are a large part of the problem of identity in the Church today. You’re as bad as modernists, and possibly worse. You have no respect for any pontiff that doesn’t bow to your demands. You have no respect for the Magisterium so long as they continue defying what you believe is the true “magisterium” of the Church—the popular demands of radicals like yourself. I’m sorry to be so blunt, but I’ve spent long enough indulging you, and pretending that you’re genuine. Your’e not genuine. You’re a deceptive snake, using deceptive tactics to sell your talking points. So you, and your alternate identities will have to go elsewhere to post your heresy, and shameless CMTV plugs. God keep you.